Episode 74: Dating Friendly

In starting out in polyamory, most people want to make rules — like no dating friends or family. It’s worth thinking more about that rule. That’s what’s on this week’s episode of Non-Monogamy Help.

Discussion Topic:

What makes a friend different from a partner to you?

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https://anchor.fm/non-monogamy-help/episodes/Episode-74---Dating-Family-e1cmd7l

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Thank you to Chris Albery-Jones at albery-jones.com for the theme music and a big thanks for the podcast art to Dom Duong at domduong.com.

Podcast transcript

My BF and I have been dating for 4 months.  We get along really well and are working on a committed fluid bonded relationship. From the start of our relationship he explained that he desires a non monogamous type relationship. He has been in them in the past in the form of one night stands or FWB type situations.

I, on the other hand, have only had traditional monogamous relationships but I am exploring non monogamy and think it would be something I’d like to try. Listening to your advice and tips has opened my mind up and given me a lot to think about.

My plan is to present my thoughts to him about it this weekend. To see, among other things, what non-monogamy looks like to him and explain what I think it would look like to me. On that thought, I’ve thought a lot about boundaries and rules.

With your insight I realised that setting them are not realistic and I do not plan to set any (apart from sexual health rules where we will use protection from now on because I can control that).  That said, I wonder about how to broach the subject of ‘friends and family’ being a potential metamours.

He has jokingly made sexual type remarks in the past about some friends and family members that make me wonder if he would want that. At the time I told him that he is no longer to do that around me. It made me fearful, jealous and felt disrespectful.

Thinking on it now though, I wonder if I have any say on whether he pursues that avenue or not? Who am I to say? I’m not saying that I would stick around if he does do that but I can’t stop him if he decides to pursue it. His choice.

So I am wondering, how you would approach this or how others have approached it?

Response:

So first and foremost, I feel like friends and family are two different categories, Putting them together is a little bit different, especially because people have different relationships with their friends and family. And for most people, friendships are a little bit more tolerable than family. Because for a lot of people, and this isn't even necessarily myself included— But for a lot of people, family is kind of like something that they don't feel comfortable just getting rid of.

And I'm not saying that people feel comfortable just getting rid of their friends. But family is a little bit different in that way, in that this is kind of the relationships that they've had for their whole life versus a friendship might be very different to them and how they define it. So I don't think friends and family are kind of in the same category. And I think that you should kind of think about that.

The second thing that I would think of is that everyone kind of has their own boundaries around how they feel. I mean, there are some people in monogamous situations where you know, they break up with someone, and then maybe like their cousin or something like that. And that can be awkward, but it is— it really just depends on the family. Like it's so specific and dependent upon the relationships that family members have with each other. I think I would feel weird if my partners dated my family members, not necessarily because I have close relationships with my family, but because I don't, and it would put me in a really awkward position because I don't necessarily want to have to interact with them.

So everyone kind of has their own boundaries around that. I think the interesting thing about polyamory that a lot of people don't realise is that within monogamy, we're kind of sold a narrative that your partner chooses you because you're the best, or they choose you for a very specific, unique kind of snowflake-y type of reason. And I'm not saying that that's not true. But you know, you kind of assume that your partner has, for lack of a better word, good taste, or— when basically, when you kind of get into a polyamorous or non monogamous situation, you sort of then see the taste of your partner. And sometimes that makes you go, “Wow, I didn't necessarily know that you would be interested in someone who you know is like this or like that”.

And because you know your friends, and you know your family members, like when your partner is interested in a random stranger, and you don't know who they are just yet and then maybe later on down the line, you find out, “oh, that person isn't, you know, that great”. Maybe they're kind of, you know, however you wanted to find that. Because, you know your friends and family members, I think sometimes when people are attracted to them and you're just sort of like, “Oh, I know about that person”.

And like,  not to say you don't think negatively of your friends, but you start to wonder what it is about yourself that maybe your partner was into. You start to wonder— it really questions that idea that like, “Oh, yes, my partner is into me, because I'm the best or the I'm, you know, I'm a good catch”. You start to go, Well, what is a good catch? And like, why is my partner interested in me? And if the thing for me, and maybe I'm being a bit of a dickhead, and I fully admit that I could be being a bit of a dickhead. But the thing for me is that I'm going like, “Oh, is my partner just interested in me, because I'm interested in them?” It's kind of the thing that kind of rocks me a little bit.

So sometimes that is part of the difficulty. It changes the way that we see our partners, especially if they choose people who are not great for them in some way. Or, it kind of makes you wonder, like, why? Like this person is— especially if they're not being treated well, and it's hard for you to just sit back— or at least it's hard for me to just sit back and go, “Oh, this person is not treating you right. Why are you with them?” That can be a really, really difficult thing. And I'm not saying anything bad of your family members or friends.

They could be great, and you totally understand what your partner sees in them. But that can be an interesting aspect of polyamory. I think it's always worth when you have kind of a feeling of “Oh, I don't know how I feel about this” kind of redefine it as a friendship and see if that changes things. So if your friend was interested in your cousin and obviously this makes family meetings and stuff a little bit more awkward, right?

Because a lot of families aren't really understanding of polyamory or get it and that might make that might make things a little bit more strange if you do have family meetups, but if your cousin was interested in this person, then I think you can realise— or if your friend was interested in your cousin, then I think you can realise, is it about the fear that my partners into somebody else? Or is it about who I know that somebody else to be. So if I had a friend who was interested in somebody, and I knew that person, probably, in my judgment of them, maybe I thought, you know, they might not be great, because I've seen them in other relationships.

And I might worry for my friends benefit, right? Then it's less about, you know, the fact that “oh, this is a bit weird” and more about, “oh, I'm a bit concerned about what this relationship is”. Now all that said, that doesn't necessarily mean that you should stop it. I think you do have the right kind of mindset, which is like, can you actually control what he does? If he does decide to date family members or friends, you can't really control that. However, the thing I would say is, you can't also promise that you're going to be cool with everything. And it's not realistic for him to expect you to just be able to be cool with everything, or be comfortable in every situation.

The one thing that I say, there are people who have been really crap to me who I don't want to be around, because they've been really crap to me, or I don't really care for them. And I'm fine— I can have partners who date those people. That's fine. The thing that I draw boundaries around is like, “Look, you can date this person, I don't particularly care for them. So I don't really want to hang out with them. I don't really want to do group dates. I don't really want to do any of that. If they're going to be in our shared living space, I would appreciate some, you know, warning, so that I can vacate the premises”, like, things like that.

And that's just because,I don't want to be around these people. And I have a right to not want to be around those people if that's something that I don't want. You don't have to just smile and be cool with everything if you can't promise that. So, you can draw those kinds of boundaries. You can say, “Look, you can date whom you like”. And I mean, this is exactly the same thing as if you were in a monogamous relationship, and you disliked your partner's friends. And that happens, sometimes. You're not obligated to like your partner's friends. And you can say, like, “Look, if you want to be friends with these people, I don't particularly care for them, they get on my nerves, whatever it is. So if they come around, let me know so I can go out. And don't invite me to like group stuff, because I don't want to do that kind of thing”.

And maybe that makes things awkward but it also makes it awkward for you to have to deal with that. So my approach to that wouldn't necessarily be “don't date my family members, or don't date, my friends”/ I would just be honest about how I felt like, yeah, if you if you date my mom, that's gonna be weird, you know. That's gonna be weird. I'm going to feel weirded out by that. And I can't guarantee that I'm going to be— nobody wants to necessarily break up over something like that. But I'm going to feel weird about that. And just try and take it on a case by case basis, rather than making a big leap to everything.

And also be willing to question your initial kind of feelings of like, “Oh, that's weird” . Because, you know, if if I did have a partner who dated a cousin, for example, instead of like, my mom or something like that, I think it would be weird. It would definitely be weird at first. But I think that, for their happiness, as long as I wasn't like— we weren't all going to big family functions all the time together and it was weird, I think I could deal with it. So you never know. And it might be that you might initially have some feelings, but you don't necessarily always have to listen to your initial feelings about stuff. You can kind of go “Okay, I feel this way”. Think about it a little bit, give yourself a little bit of time and don't make rushed decisions about things and see how you feel about it.

If you still feel uncomfortable after a while, then that's fine. You're allowed to be uncomfortable about stuff and you're allowed to go, “I don't think so I think I'm gonna nope out of the situation” or change your partnership in such a way where you don't live together, or however that may be. And that may seem really scary. But the thing that is important to remember is that you have no idea what the future holds. You may think now that putting a boundary around like “Okay, you can't date my friends or family members because that would be weird”. But you have no idea what will happen and who he's necessarily going to date.

Later on down the line, he may date someone that makes you feel way weirder than any friend or family member could ever make you feel and you can't really control that. You may foresee some discomfort and maybe like, “Oh, I want to stop this”. Instead of doing that just go “Okay”. And don't make promises about— that's one thing that a lot of people do is that they, especially in polyamory, like you— if you are the partner that is scared of making your partner feel uncomfortable— you are going to want to be like, “Are you okay? Are you okay? Please tell me that you're okay”.

You can't promise all the time to be okay. And even if your partner does kind of put pressure on you to do that for the sake of feeling comfortable themselves, don't give in to that. Don't promise to be okay in every situation. You can't predict how you're necessarily going to feel in every situation. But you can promise that you'll take a case by case approach to stuff, that you will try to be respectful of their feelings, and that they and you both will be respectful of each other's boundaries around the situation. That is probably the approach that I would take to that.

So again, to kind of wrap up, friends and family or, you know, for most people, are very different categories. And so it's it's important not to just lump those together, because they are very different categories to a lot of people. Figure out amongst each other how you define those categories, and what you think about that. Talk about it.

The second thing is that it is interesting that within polyamory, the fact that you can see who else your partner chooses, can sometimes affect your relationship, and sometimes for the better sometimes, for the worse, sometimes it's just interesting to see the choices that your partner chooses to make. And it does kind of call into question, the narrative that monogamy gives you, which is that your partner has chosen you because you are the best, and you have won the race and yada, yada.

And that is really a really interesting thing to experience. The third thing is if you want to sit with your discomfort and kind of examine it, and think about why it is you feel the way that you do, it's always good to ask how would you feel if your friend did this instead of your partner. Just because sometimes that takes a little bit of the fear of loss and the fear of sexual competition, a lot of the different things that people experience in polyamory, away from that and makes you kind of a little bit calmer about it and makes you rethink it.

And then last but not least, you can't promise that you're going to be happy about every choice. So don't promise that. He shouldn't be promising that either. Just try and take it case by case. Try to be willing to step back. Think about your feelings a bit not making a quick harsh judgments. And also, don't be afraid to set boundaries around what you're willing to be around because that's not necessarily a bad thing. Again, think about it as if you have a partner— you're monogamous and you have a partner who has friends that you really don't like. Similar boundaries around that. Doesn't mean you have to break up, but it does mean that you kind of have to work around that. So I hope that helps and good luck.